Anishinaabe author Linda LeGarde Grover on the power of stories to connect
Linda LeGarde Grover
Courtesy Linda LeGarde Grover
Anishinaabe author Linda LeGarde Grover, Bois Forte Band, talks with host Cathy Wurzer about the power of stories to strengthen families and cultural connections.
LeGarde is professor emeritus of American Indian Studies at the University of Minnesota Duluth and her latest book is called “Gichigami Hearts.”
Use the audio player above to listen to the full conversation. Subscribe to the Minnesota Now podcast on Apple Podcasts, Google Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.
We attempt to make transcripts for Minnesota Now available the next business day after a broadcast. When ready they will appear here.
Correction (Dec. 1, 2022): An earlier version of this article misspelled Linda LeGarde Grover’s name. The article has been updated.
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Audio transcript
CATHY WURZER: On Minnesota Now, we love to talk to creatives around the state to get some insight into their art and their lives. Our next guest is Linda LeGarde Grover. Linda is a novelist and writer, Professor Emeritus of American Indian Studies at the University of Minnesota-Duluth, and a member of the Bois Forte Band of Ojibwe and she's on the line.
Her newest book is called Gichigami Hearts. Linda LeGarde Grover, I'm so happy you're here. Thanks for joining us.
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Thank you for having me, Cathy. Boozhoo. Aaniin. [Ojibwe for hello.]
CATHY WURZER: Say, for folks who've not yet read Gichigami Hearts, what's it all about?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: There is some poetry in there. There's some fiction, some memoir. There is something about some of the very old traditional stories and how they parallel and connect to events in our lives today. There's some family stories in there.
It's a collection, I guess, is what you would say. The subtitle of this is Stories and Histories from Misaabekong. And I guess that kind of says it-- stories and histories.
CATHY WURZER: Tell me about the importance of documenting family history, documenting cultural history.
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Well, family and all of our histories were passed down by way of oral tradition and still are. And nowadays, some of us are doing some of this in the written word, which is another form of communication and of passing knowledge down. We are, all of us, very respectful and aware of what passing knowledge down really has meant for Ojibwe people over the generations.
And so we take great care in what we do and how we do it. It's not that things would be lost if we didn't write them down, because they've always continued. But this is a way of being part of that continuity of existence.
CATHY WURZER: What stories stand out to you from your family that resonate within your heart?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: There is quite a bit in Gichigami Hearts about my family's experiences in American Indian boarding schools and in movement, relocation, from one place to another. The great Ojibwe migration from the East Coast is in here to where we are today, but also the impact of settlers here, and of treaties, and of the movement of and relocation of people to other places and the establishment of reservations.
I guess that sounds like a long story, but it's after that, the assimilationist policies that government put in place after that, especially the federal Indian boarding school program, which went beyond federal, I have to say, is something that is so interwoven with the history of Native families around here and with mine. It cannot be separated from historical and contemporary experience also.
CATHY WURZER: And it's painful history. It's very painful history. How have you worked through that?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Well, I don't think there's a working through it. It exists. It is a history. And it may be something that is intangible, but that doesn't make it as strong and real, maybe even more real, than tangibles in our lives.
And so it is a story that will tell itself. Some of us are part of the telling of that story. But no matter if we tell it or not, it exists. And it certainly is-- I don't even want to say it affects us, because I don't know if that's the word for it.
It is part of us and we are part of it. So we have become part of the story.
CATHY WURZER: I understand what you're saying. Gosh, it's so personal. And how do you feel about sharing that with the world?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: I think I am careful about what I share with the world in written word, especially. I feel great appreciation and the obligation to care for and protect the people who went before us in all ways. And so the people who kept the cultural beliefs going, the people who did what they could and succeeded or didn't succeed, people who thrived, people who didn't thrive, people who didn't survive at all-- I always keep them in mind.
It's certainly their story. And it's not mine to just take and write about.
CATHY WURZER: Tell me about the poetry that you've been writing. You and I were talking just a little bit before we started the interview about poetry. What's that like?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Some of the poems that I have written are in Gichigami Hearts. And my poetry collection has just been published by the University of Minnesota Press in October. It is a revised and expanded edition of a collection that was published by a small independent press some years ago. And it is called The Sky Watched Poems of Ojibwe Life.
Within this, I've divided things into four sections. And I do that a lot. And I think a lot of Native people do because the patterns of fours and the repeating and the significance of that number are so present in our ways of being.
And so I begin with some of the early takes on some of the stories, some of my reactions, I think, to kind of establish our ways of being in our beliefs and presence. Then the next section is the impact, especially of the boarding school system, on those ways of being. And the third section, then, is the aftermath-- in some ways, it's almost like crawling out from under a rock in my generation. And then the last section is life and as an older Native woman today, and continuing those foundational values, especially the one of gratitude and appreciation in what we do throughout our lives.
CATHY WURZER: I'm glad you brought up gratitude. What are you most grateful for right now?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Oh my goodness, just our existence. We are so fortunate to be here. The creator made everything. We didn't make anything. We still don't, even though we might think we do.
And we express our gratitude for that every day and remember to live it that way. We didn't create something. We've been given a great deal. Because of that, of course, we're grateful. But we should be generous people-- generous not just physically, but also having a generous heart and spirit is what it's all about to me being an Ojibwe person.
My dad used to tell me and us kids too, when you get up in the morning, the first thing you should do is thank God for making you an Indian. And in those words, I came to understand what he meant-- to be an Anishinaabe person.
CATHY WURZER: I've never heard that before. That is beautiful.
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Yeah, I always thought so.
CATHY WURZER: What about writing and telling stories feeds your soul?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: I consider myself more of a conduit and shaper of words and concepts. And so it's the most fun there is in the world, of course, writing stuff. And I never tire of it.
But I do it because I feel that we all have been created, our belief is, with specific things tasks to do that will change as our lives unfold here. And I think this is one of the tasks that I've been given. And it's a real honor to be able to do this.
CATHY WURZER: And you're so good at it too. Oh my goodness. Say, before you go, I always ask-- it's true, though. It's very true. Before you go, I always ask this of all artists-- what is inspiring you right now?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: The ancestors and the generations before me-- their existence and what they have done to make it possible for us to be here today. I think of them all the time.
CATHY WURZER: Do you feel that they're guiding you?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Well, I hope so. It is my great hope and that one day, perhaps, I will do the same for generations that follow me.
CATHY WURZER: We need to leave it there, I think. That's a great way to end this conversation. Linda LeGarde Grover, thank you so much. I've been honored to have you with us.
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: [NON-ENGLISH SPEECH] It has been my honor and pleasure.
CATHY WURZER: Linda LeGarde Grover is a novelist and writer, Professor Emeritus of American Indian Studies at the University of Minnesota-Duluth, and a member of the Bois Forte Band of Ojibwe. Her newest book is called Gichigami Hearts, and the book of poetry she mentioned that was rereleased this year called the Sky Watched.
Her newest book is called Gichigami Hearts. Linda LeGarde Grover, I'm so happy you're here. Thanks for joining us.
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Thank you for having me, Cathy. Boozhoo. Aaniin. [Ojibwe for hello.]
CATHY WURZER: Say, for folks who've not yet read Gichigami Hearts, what's it all about?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: There is some poetry in there. There's some fiction, some memoir. There is something about some of the very old traditional stories and how they parallel and connect to events in our lives today. There's some family stories in there.
It's a collection, I guess, is what you would say. The subtitle of this is Stories and Histories from Misaabekong. And I guess that kind of says it-- stories and histories.
CATHY WURZER: Tell me about the importance of documenting family history, documenting cultural history.
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Well, family and all of our histories were passed down by way of oral tradition and still are. And nowadays, some of us are doing some of this in the written word, which is another form of communication and of passing knowledge down. We are, all of us, very respectful and aware of what passing knowledge down really has meant for Ojibwe people over the generations.
And so we take great care in what we do and how we do it. It's not that things would be lost if we didn't write them down, because they've always continued. But this is a way of being part of that continuity of existence.
CATHY WURZER: What stories stand out to you from your family that resonate within your heart?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: There is quite a bit in Gichigami Hearts about my family's experiences in American Indian boarding schools and in movement, relocation, from one place to another. The great Ojibwe migration from the East Coast is in here to where we are today, but also the impact of settlers here, and of treaties, and of the movement of and relocation of people to other places and the establishment of reservations.
I guess that sounds like a long story, but it's after that, the assimilationist policies that government put in place after that, especially the federal Indian boarding school program, which went beyond federal, I have to say, is something that is so interwoven with the history of Native families around here and with mine. It cannot be separated from historical and contemporary experience also.
CATHY WURZER: And it's painful history. It's very painful history. How have you worked through that?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Well, I don't think there's a working through it. It exists. It is a history. And it may be something that is intangible, but that doesn't make it as strong and real, maybe even more real, than tangibles in our lives.
And so it is a story that will tell itself. Some of us are part of the telling of that story. But no matter if we tell it or not, it exists. And it certainly is-- I don't even want to say it affects us, because I don't know if that's the word for it.
It is part of us and we are part of it. So we have become part of the story.
CATHY WURZER: I understand what you're saying. Gosh, it's so personal. And how do you feel about sharing that with the world?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: I think I am careful about what I share with the world in written word, especially. I feel great appreciation and the obligation to care for and protect the people who went before us in all ways. And so the people who kept the cultural beliefs going, the people who did what they could and succeeded or didn't succeed, people who thrived, people who didn't thrive, people who didn't survive at all-- I always keep them in mind.
It's certainly their story. And it's not mine to just take and write about.
CATHY WURZER: Tell me about the poetry that you've been writing. You and I were talking just a little bit before we started the interview about poetry. What's that like?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Some of the poems that I have written are in Gichigami Hearts. And my poetry collection has just been published by the University of Minnesota Press in October. It is a revised and expanded edition of a collection that was published by a small independent press some years ago. And it is called The Sky Watched Poems of Ojibwe Life.
Within this, I've divided things into four sections. And I do that a lot. And I think a lot of Native people do because the patterns of fours and the repeating and the significance of that number are so present in our ways of being.
And so I begin with some of the early takes on some of the stories, some of my reactions, I think, to kind of establish our ways of being in our beliefs and presence. Then the next section is the impact, especially of the boarding school system, on those ways of being. And the third section, then, is the aftermath-- in some ways, it's almost like crawling out from under a rock in my generation. And then the last section is life and as an older Native woman today, and continuing those foundational values, especially the one of gratitude and appreciation in what we do throughout our lives.
CATHY WURZER: I'm glad you brought up gratitude. What are you most grateful for right now?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Oh my goodness, just our existence. We are so fortunate to be here. The creator made everything. We didn't make anything. We still don't, even though we might think we do.
And we express our gratitude for that every day and remember to live it that way. We didn't create something. We've been given a great deal. Because of that, of course, we're grateful. But we should be generous people-- generous not just physically, but also having a generous heart and spirit is what it's all about to me being an Ojibwe person.
My dad used to tell me and us kids too, when you get up in the morning, the first thing you should do is thank God for making you an Indian. And in those words, I came to understand what he meant-- to be an Anishinaabe person.
CATHY WURZER: I've never heard that before. That is beautiful.
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Yeah, I always thought so.
CATHY WURZER: What about writing and telling stories feeds your soul?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: I consider myself more of a conduit and shaper of words and concepts. And so it's the most fun there is in the world, of course, writing stuff. And I never tire of it.
But I do it because I feel that we all have been created, our belief is, with specific things tasks to do that will change as our lives unfold here. And I think this is one of the tasks that I've been given. And it's a real honor to be able to do this.
CATHY WURZER: And you're so good at it too. Oh my goodness. Say, before you go, I always ask-- it's true, though. It's very true. Before you go, I always ask this of all artists-- what is inspiring you right now?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: The ancestors and the generations before me-- their existence and what they have done to make it possible for us to be here today. I think of them all the time.
CATHY WURZER: Do you feel that they're guiding you?
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: Well, I hope so. It is my great hope and that one day, perhaps, I will do the same for generations that follow me.
CATHY WURZER: We need to leave it there, I think. That's a great way to end this conversation. Linda LeGarde Grover, thank you so much. I've been honored to have you with us.
LINDA LEGARDE GROVER: [NON-ENGLISH SPEECH] It has been my honor and pleasure.
CATHY WURZER: Linda LeGarde Grover is a novelist and writer, Professor Emeritus of American Indian Studies at the University of Minnesota-Duluth, and a member of the Bois Forte Band of Ojibwe. Her newest book is called Gichigami Hearts, and the book of poetry she mentioned that was rereleased this year called the Sky Watched.
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