With no special session in sight, some Minnesota mayors ask lawmakers to let them restrict guns

[MUSIC PLAYING] NINA MOINI: Mayors across the Twin Cities metro and beyond are calling for the Minnesota Legislature to repeal a state law that prevents cities from enacting their own gun regulations. The call comes in the wake of the August shooting at Annunciation Catholic Church and School, where two children were killed and dozens of others were wounded during a back-to-school mass. Mayor Kim Norton of Rochester is one of the mayors pushing for a change in state law. She joins me now. Thanks for taking the time this afternoon, Mayor Norton.

KIM NORTON: Thank you, Nina. Happy to be here.

NINA MOINI: To start, for those who are unfamiliar, can you share more about this state law, this preemption law, and what it says and why it's in place?

KIM NORTON: So the preemption law sets a bar at the state level and says that local units of government are not allowed to make the laws any stricter. So we live within whatever barrier or law the state sets, despite wanting to do something different at a local level, and it's called preemption. And we are calling for that to be lifted and examined so that cities have more control over the laws that impact their residents.

NINA MOINI: Do you see this as something that is top of mind for lawmakers? I know you used to serve in the Minnesota House. Do you think this has a good chance of happening?

KIM NORTON: I think it might be an easier sell than asking our legislators to weigh in on something that is very politically charged. Preemption simply opens the door for local units of government to take that and feel that pressure, but it does allow us to protect our residents in the way we feel best at the local level. So it wouldn't be statewide. So I think if they're going to make changes, that's one we would like them to consider. If they want to do it statewide, I think we would be quite happy with that, but we know that that's a heavy lift.

NINA MOINI: And just to clarify, would that just be related to these laws, or all laws? Because the fear might be that if you open the door to that, that this will continue to happen and preempt state law.

KIM NORTON: Yes, I think the specific laws that St. Paul has outlined include a ban on public possession of assault weapons, a ban on binary triggers and high-capacity magazines, a ban on guns in sensitive places-- for me, this one is of particular interest-- and also requiring firearms to have a serial number. So those are the four that St. Paul, anyway, is pressing for. I certainly would be interested in looking over the laws and seeing what's right for our community, but those are certainly four that we're asking the state to consider lifting the preemption on.

NINA MOINI: Mm-hmm. And this was at a press conference yesterday at the Capitol, where many mayors were there talking about this. And it really is not just Minneapolis and St. Paul. That's another reason we're really happy to have your time today, because this is a statewide issue, is it not? I'm curious to know, from your position, ever since the horrible mass shooting at Annunciation, what have you been hearing from your constituents even in Rochester?

KIM NORTON: Well, I certainly have taken calls from very concerned parents who have very young children in schools, and this was shocking to them. So I have heard from them. This has been an issue, however, that's been happening in this country, and growing numbers of the mass shootings continue to increase. My interest was not just mass shootings but also accidental deaths and suicides, which are very high when you look at the number of gun deaths.

And some of these measures, and I mentioned particularly the sensitive city-owned places, is really one of those places where we can protect our residents. So libraries, our city hall, at the Capitol. I was always concerned about the Capitol building itself allows guns to be present. A rec center, sporting events-- of course, schools have their own rules, but we have not been allowed to have those rules for our own buildings. It could include the zoo or museums or beaches. We're just not given that authority by the state to do what we think is best for our community, and we would like them to offer that up for us.

NINA MOINI: In the case of being able to regulate firearms in sensitive public places, I imagine that would be one that could be regulated. Some of the other ones, do you think that for, let's just say a ban on assault weapons, large-capacity magazines, and binary triggers within city limits, how would that be enforced?

KIM NORTON: I think right now we have to live within the letter of the law. So I think what St. Paul has been asking, and will do-- and it sounds like Minneapolis and perhaps some of the rest of us will look at these items-- put it in place so that when we are given the right to enforce them, we are ready.

So we know that there are restrictions and things we can and can't do. For instance, a city can only set misdemeanor charges. A gross misdemeanor or a felony is set at a different level outside of city ordinance. So the laws that we might put in place, the ordinance to be ready for permission to do them would be low-level-- I don't have the right word, but the--

NINA MOINI: Offenses.

KIM NORTON: --penalty would be low-level, yes, on those. Until such time as the ban was lifted, and then we could ask the state to help us with a higher level, if we believe it's needed.

NINA MOINI: Mm-hmm. It sounds like some of the mayors got together here and, like you were alluding to earlier, said, if the votes are not there because the party numbers are so close at the state legislature, if it's just not there for Governor Tim Walz to think that it's time to call a special session-- because as we've learned through this process, sometimes leaders are reluctant, governors, to call a special session. Unless they already have something worked out, because they don't want to waste time, and then make things look worse, perhaps, to the public. But I wonder even at an ordinance, at a city level in Rochester, if you expect anything like this to be met with pushback? Because those stronger political beliefs are everywhere, and at every level of government, especially these days.

KIM NORTON: They absolutely are. The only thing I guess I would counter that with is, as mayors, we are very close-- and as city council members, because ultimately, in the city of Rochester, that's who would have to enact something-- we're very close to the people. We live in neighborhoods we represent. The city council members represent specific wards. I represent at large. So we're closer to the people.

We will absolutely hear from people who don't want anybody to touch any gun laws. I can tell you, from personal experience, how fierce that opposition is. And I won't go into details, but it was very difficult to carry those pieces of legislation, even though they didn't get hearings at the time. And I expect that kind of pushback, but I also know that the majority of people in our community would welcome these changes. So, yes, there's political pushback, and we have the support of the majority of residents that live here for a number of these. We just have to figure out which ones are best for our community.

NINA MOINI: You know, on the 27th of this month, that will have been two months since the mass shooting at Annunciation, which is hard to believe. I wonder if you feel like it is time for a special session to address the law change that the cities are looking for, the preemption law, some of these other things? Do you think that that's going to happen, or should happen, as soon as possible with a special session? Or are you just looking ahead to the regular session at this point?

KIM NORTON: Well, I would love to say I'm sure we're going to have a special session. I just know how difficult this issue is. I know how difficult it will be to pull a majority of people to a particular issue. And sometimes that means not getting everything you want but getting something you want. And so from the mayors' and local governments' position, we're saying, lift the preemption and let us make some decisions. That, I think, will be an easier lift. If they can do better than that, I'm all for it. I think you would find many mayors happy to see a special session, and the governor have some legislation in front of him to sign. I'm just not sure that we're going to get there.

NINA MOINI: All right, Mayor Norton, thank you so much for your time this afternoon. Really appreciate it.

KIM NORTON: Absolutely. Thank you.

NINA MOINI: That was Mayor Kim Norton of Rochester. And a note to our Rochester listeners, Politics Friday, my favorite show, will be in Rochester next Tuesday, because they're recording a show ahead of time with a live audience. Mayor Norton will be one of the guests, along with some other local civic leaders. It should be a great time. If you want to be in attendance, go to mprevents.org.