Klobuchar: Cuts to public broadcasting 'couldn't be coming at a worse time'

[MUSIC PLAYING] NINA MOINI: Our top story today, the US Senate approved a rescissions package that cuts $1.1 billion from public media over the next two years. That includes funding from the Corporation of Public Broadcasting that goes to 16 media organizations in Minnesota. Some of those organizations are MPR News and our sister music stations, as well as regional PBS stations and small radio stations.

At those smaller stations, federal dollars cover up to half the budget. I want to add that while NPR receives money from the Corporation for Public Broadcasting, when we are reporting on the business of NPR and public media, we do so independently from news executives and do not let them review material before it runs.

US Senator Amy Klobuchar has expressed these cuts could shutter tribal and rural radio stations. She joins me now to talk about this. Senator, thank you for your time this afternoon.

AMY KLOBUCHAR: Thank you, Nina. And I just can't tell you how strongly I feel about this. This is so wrong, when you look at the service that's provided, especially in rural areas, in places like Bemidji and in Grand Marais and in Granite Falls. These are places that do not always have a local station in terms of TV or radio that's devoted to their news. And it's a way being done at Austin, at the PBS station down there. They are able to-- and Albert Lea.

They're able to cover stories that are unique to the area or disaster alerts. The Grand Marais WTIP radio station is going to be talking a lot more about the Canadian wildfires than maybe they are in The New York Times.

NINA MOINI: Are tribal stations getting any protection from these cuts, Senator?

AMY KLOBUCHAR: No. There were motions and amendments to try to protect the funding to its 1.1 billion, as you noted. There was also another 9 billion or so of foreign aid. The thing that got protected was PEPFAR, which is very good. That was the work that's been done, starting with President Bush, to cure AIDS across the world, particularly in Africa.

But so many of these organizations didn't get exempted, and that includes UNICEF. That funding has been cut. That includes the Institute for Peace. That includes a whole bunch of work that's being done in Ukraine.

NINA MOINI: You mentioned cuts to, of course, public media that we're talking about, cuts to foreign aid. And frustration, it sounds like, on the part of yourself and Democrats that-- what is the strategy moving forward? Because it seems like that from what you're saying, you don't feel very confident that Democrats would be able to convince very many Republicans to where it would make a difference in the vote, to not vote along the party line or vote with President Trump. Are Democrats strategizing about how to try to bridge that divide? Or it sounds like you're saying, the party will always vote that way. And what does that leave Democrats with?

AMY KLOBUCHAR: Well, there clearly were people that had qualms about this on the Republican side. So a few things. Number one, this won't apply, most likely in this case, but a bunch of court cases have been won in different contexts across the country. People have been given their jobs back. Funding has been renewed. So that's the first.

The second thing is politics, the midterms. There's a whole bunch of people, the vast majority of the American people, believe that we should have these stations. They know in Florida that these stations help them during hurricanes. They understand the emergency alerts. Senator Murkowski told the story, the Republican from Alaska, of how just that day, there had been fears of tsunamis and a very major, major weather alert in Alaska. And the only stations available to provide it were the public stations. So as you see this fragmented media and a bunch of media organizations shutting down, you really need these stations.

So the politics of this, in terms of the midterm elections and people standing up, that's going to be on us to win elections, to put up good candidates, and to take this on. So that's the honest way to do this. The third way-- courts, elections.

And the third way would be if there's other bills in the future where some of these things are actually supported by Republicans, as we go into the budgets going forward, we make agreements. But the president at this point has to sign off on them. So that would be the third to bring back some of this funding. That doesn't seem likely now, but this happens all the time in this kind of sausage making of Washington, DC. So that's the other possibility. I just wish I could give you some great news right now that the House of Representatives is going to have a change of heart, but I don't see that happening.

Finally, states can step in if-- especially with some of these rural stations-- if they believe that they're important. Nothing is stopping states from coming in. Private donors are going to have to step up. All of those things would be the only way to keep these public stations going, when some of them are-- 15% of their budget was out of the national Corporation for Public Broadcasting.

Some were 20%. Some were 30%. And so that's around the country what you saw with the rural stations. 2 to 1, again, rural to urban, when you look at the percentages. 20% of the funding for rural came from this. But only 9% for more urban stations.

So it is a big gut punch. But it's more importantly a gut punch to news and a gut punch to kids programming, where you don't have to be inundated with crazy ads and links to pornography. It is a gut punch to this idea of having civil debate about issues or learning about business from marketplace and feeling like you can listen to something without being just slammed with a bunch of advertisements but also a bunch of just angry, angry vitriol like you see online.

I want to see more civic debate, even if I don't agree with people. And I think that's one of the virtues of public radio and public TV. And so I just hope we will find a way, especially in Minnesota, to keep this going without this federal funding, until we find a way to bring it back, which I will never give up on. And I believe at some point, we will be victorious.

NINA MOINI: Senator, I do want to ask, what about Republicans who voted in favor, who say, well, I'm not just going ahead and voting with whatever President Trump says? Some people believe that it's a good idea to separate government funding from media in general and that perhaps if smaller stations need federal funding to get by, then maybe there isn't a market for them anymore. People are going to their phones, plenty of other places for information, like you alluded to. What is your response to that?

AMY KLOBUCHAR: Well, we have had this idea of public radio and public TV for decades and decades and decades, through very conservative presidents and liberal presidents. And that's because we as a country decided that while we're not going to foot the whole bill, things like not just public radio and public TV but like Voice of America and all of these allowed formats for Americans with our uniquely participatory democracy to be able to get information out and bring people together.

If we live under a dictatorship, where Vladimir Putin decides what's going to be on a Russian TV on RT all the time, that's a different model. But we have a uniquely American participatory model, which I believe has served us well and served our economy well over the years. And that is why Democrats and Republicans have come together and said, it's not going to be our only media. No way. It's going to be a part of the media. But we want to have that fundamental part of our media. And that has been decided since Congress authorized the Public Broadcasting Act of 1967.

And so I just-- that to me, it's just a piece of the pie, but it's an increasingly important one because of the fact that with the social media companies raking in so much money off the content of what are-- you name it-- television, networks, or newspapers-- and these are private entities. They've been taking their content, putting it up online without being reimbursed. And then those traditional news organizations, with the exceptions of the big ones, are really, really suffering. And even some of the big ones are suffering.

So to me, when you've got that media landscape where we're losing newspapers every single day in this country, and we're losing-- it makes the role of public TV and public radio even more important. And so that's why I just think this couldn't be coming at a worse time. All of this being said, the doom and gloom. You know me. I just continue to believe that we will find a way-- we always do-- through this, because the American people are good at heart. And we tend to find a way to do the right things, even after we tried doing all the wrong things. That's a paraphrase of Winston Churchill. But there will be a way. And we must keep the public broadcasting piece of this strong, especially when we're seeing a breakdown in other traditional media.

NINA MOINI: Senator, thank you for your time. I appreciate it.

AMY KLOBUCHAR: Thank you.

NINA MOINI: That was US Senator Amy Klobuchar.