Famed Minnesota filmmaker tells the story of 1970s musical duo with a resurgent following
A still from "Dreamin' Wild."
Provided by MSPIFF
To say that Minnesota-based filmmaker Bill Pohlad has an impressive resume is an understatement.
He has producing credits for “12 Years a Slave,” “The Tree of Life” and “Into the Wild.” As an executive producer, Bill’s credits include “Brokeback Mountain” and the documentary “Food, Inc.” He directed the 2014 film “Love & Mercy” about the Beach Boys’ Brian Wilson.
A new film from Pohlad opening Friday tells the story of a 1970s musical duo, brothers Donnie and Joe Emerson. If you haven’t heard of Donnie and Joe, neither had most of the world — until their album was rediscovered by crate diggers in 2008.
MPR News host Cathy Wurzer talked with Pohlad about the movie, which is called “Dreamin’ Wild.”
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Pohlad is slated to introduce the 7:15 p.m. screening Friday at the Main Cinema in Minneapolis.
Use the audio player above to listen to the full conversation.
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Audio transcript
CATHY WURZER: To say that Minnesota-based filmmaker Bill Pohlad has an impressive resume is an understatement. He has producing credits for 12 Years A Slave, The Tree Of Life, and Into The Wild. As an executive producer, Bill's credits include Brokeback Mountain and the documentary, Food, Inc. He directed the 2014 film Love and Mercy about the Beach Boys' Brian Wilson.
A new film that opens Friday from Bill Pohlad tells the story of a '70s musical duo, brothers Donnie and Joe Emerson. If you haven't heard of Donnie and Joe, neither had most of the world until their album was rediscovered by crate diggers in 2008. Here's the movie trailer.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
- Bye, Dad.
- Bye, buddy.
- Love you, Dad.
- Hey, Nance. Where's the band?
- They bailed.
- Seriously? Trying to run a business here.
- Also, the bank called.
[PHONE RINGING]
- Hey, brother.
- Joe?
- I got something to tell you. I got a call yesterday from a guy at a record company. He says he heard our record and--
- Our record? What do you mean?
- "Dreamin' Wild."
- Great to meet you. Wanted to talk to you about this.
- There it is. It's "Dreamin' Wild."
- That's you guys?
- Yep. That's us.
- This album is unbelievable. Truly. It really just blew my mind.
CATHY WURZER: The movie is called Dreamin' Wild. Its director, Bill Pohlad, is on the line. Good to have you here.
BILL POHLAD: Nice to be here, Cathy.
CATHY WURZER: This story was brought to you, I understand, by another Minnesota producer, Jim Burke, who won the Oscar for Green Book not too long ago. When Jim told you about Donnie and Joe Emerson and the story, what about it piqued your interest?
BILL POHLAD: Well, to be honest, nothing. I mean, not nothing, but at the time, I said, no. Because he pitched me the story-- it sounded a little bit like Searching for Sugar Man, the documentary, which I had seen and liked. So I don't want to do something that's been done before.
So I kind of said no, and he said, well, just listen to the music and read the article that was in The New York Times. And so I did. But ultimately, it was-- I mean, it's a cool story, for sure. But for me, it was meeting Donnie, the real Donnie, and Joe, that really, you know, made me do it. They're such extraordinary people, and the family is really amazing, so.
CATHY WURZER: How involved was the Emerson family in the creation of the film?
BILL POHLAD: Pretty involved. I mean, well, in a good way, they were involved. I mean, sometimes when you're doing stories about real people, you know, it can get complicated if the real people are involved, because they're trying to say, oh, that's not the way it was, or I said this or that, you know. They start getting into the making of the movie, and that's not really healthy.
But you know, they were very involved. We got to shoot on the actual farm in Fruitland, Washington, which is something that never happens. You don't really have that opportunity, generally. So we actually were able to shoot on the real location where everything happened. And again, they were great, the family.
CATHY WURZER: So they did play a role in the creation. And because this is a real-life story, and as you know, real-life stories can be messy, you know, trying to bring that to the big screen can be kind of tricky. What are the issues that you had to navigate in depicting real-life characters?
BILL POHLAD: Well, no, like you say, there's a tendency to, kind of, glorify or dramatize a story, any story. But I mean, what I liked-- what I was most drawn to about these people is that they're so authentic and real, so to speak.
So the challenge was always to represent it well, but be able to kind of give a feel for that closeness for the emotion that happens between them and what-- you know, for the kind of extraordinary people they are. I mean, Don Sr., the father, you know, basically, mortgaged his farm to give Donnie a chance to be successful. But he kind of did it graciously and willingly. And you know, as the film resolves itself, he's generally not-- doesn't have any regrets about that.
CATHY WURZER: It sounds as though the record made by the Emersons carries with it some serious baggage that has affected the family even, what, three decades after the record came out. You mentioned that the father mortgaged the farm. So how has the record reverberated throughout the family narrative?
BILL POHLAD: Well, I mean, you know, first time I met them, they were all about Donnie and all about the record, even though it had happened 30 years ago. They're all still huge Donnie fans and supportive of him and Joe. So yeah, it's-- obviously, the story itself affects the family and is a big factor in the family, even now.
But you know, the movie-- then you layer the movie-making, the movie on top of all of that. And you know, it was a situation where Donnie had a lot of guilt, based on the money that had been spent. And he, you know, didn't really get rid of that guilt over the years.
But you know, the movie is really about dealing with that guilt and those issues of loyalty and responsibility and, really, faith. Because the family's very religious. I mean, we don't hit that on the head or on the nose, but they're an extraordinarily good family, really wonderful family, so.
CATHY WURZER: As I said, real-life stories can be pretty messy but intriguing, you know. Very intriguing. Say, given your screen credits, with the Brian Wilson film, which was terrific-- you did The Runaways, and Radio Utopia-- is there something about musicians that intrigues you?
BILL POHLAD: Well, yeah, I suppose I'm a frustrated musician.
[CATHY LAUGHS]
And-- but I get to channel that through my work sometimes, which is great. You know, obviously, Brian Wilson was a great opportunity to explore that music and to explore, you know, the sounds and all that, that Brian was hearing at that time.
And I wasn't really intending to do another music movie, but when I had met Donnie, it convinced me that, you know, there was something more to this story than the music. It was the human emotions and connections of people, so.
CATHY WURZER: How did it feel to get back in the director's chair?
BILL POHLAD: Fantastic. I mean, you know, I never really wanted to stop, so to speak. But you do-- like, after doing, like, Love and Mercy, you want to make sure that you pick something that you're really passionate about. Because it takes, you know, three years, four years of your life.
And so you really have to be committed to it. At least, that's how I feel. And you know, so you put all your passion into it, so you got to make sure it's the right thing.
CATHY WURZER: And I would-- I've never directed a film, but I would assume that you've got to take and put a lot of your personal energy into getting the best performance from your actors, and you had a heck of a cast to work with.
BILL POHLAD: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, so that is the big-- the job of the director to, kind of, marshal all the forces, so to speak. We had, you know, Casey Affleck, great actor. And not that you just let 'em go-- you still have to provide direction and insight into the characters that will help him.
But you know, he-- obviously, he is very experienced and can do a lot with a little. The rest of the actors-- Zooey Deschanel, Walton Goggins, and Beau Bridges in particular-- all amazing people. They all really connected with the family itself, and with me, and with the message of the story. So it was a joy, honestly, to direct them.
CATHY WURZER: So the family has seen the film, I'm presuming, which must be a little tough-- to let the principles of the story see your work in the end. What did they say about the film?
BILL POHLAD: Yeah, so we premiered the film in Venice, at the Venice Film Festival, in September, last September. And so we-- I took the film to Spokane just before leaving for Venice and showed 'em the film. And it was, obviously, a stressful time. You don't know how they're going to react.
But at the end of the movie, honestly, they, whatever, gave a standing ovation. And Donnie came over and hugged me for an extended period. Really moving. So the whole thing was fantastic-- the relationship with the family and all.
CATHY WURZER: Good, good. Say, before you go, I must ask you this. One of the big debates, of course, in the movie industry is AI, right? You can make younger versions of key characters, could drive more decisions for Hollywood about what projects to greenlight. What do you think artificial intelligence will mean for artistic expression moving forward? Have you thought about it?
BILL POHLAD: Well, yeah, you think about it. I mean, I'm not a big fan. Certainly, artificial intelligence can help us in a lot of different ways and, kind of, even assist in the movie-making process. But I don't think directly being involved in either writing or so-called film-making should be used, I don't think. I don't really favor that, so.
CATHY WURZER: Bill Pohlad, I appreciate your time. It was really fun talking to you. Thank you so very much.
BILL POHLAD: Thank you. It's great to be here.
CATHY WURZER: Bill Pohlad is the director of the new film, Dreamin' Wild, out tomorrow. He'll introduce the 7:15 PM screening tomorrow at the main cinema in Minneapolis.
[DONNIE AND JOHN EMERSON, "BABY"]
SONG: When you're out in the moonlight, lookin' up on the stars above, feels so good when I'm near you, holding hands and making love. Ooh, ooh, baby. Yes, oh, baby.
CATHY WURZER: It's nice to hear the Emersons, Donnie and Joe Emerson.
A new film that opens Friday from Bill Pohlad tells the story of a '70s musical duo, brothers Donnie and Joe Emerson. If you haven't heard of Donnie and Joe, neither had most of the world until their album was rediscovered by crate diggers in 2008. Here's the movie trailer.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
- Bye, Dad.
- Bye, buddy.
- Love you, Dad.
- Hey, Nance. Where's the band?
- They bailed.
- Seriously? Trying to run a business here.
- Also, the bank called.
[PHONE RINGING]
- Hey, brother.
- Joe?
- I got something to tell you. I got a call yesterday from a guy at a record company. He says he heard our record and--
- Our record? What do you mean?
- "Dreamin' Wild."
- Great to meet you. Wanted to talk to you about this.
- There it is. It's "Dreamin' Wild."
- That's you guys?
- Yep. That's us.
- This album is unbelievable. Truly. It really just blew my mind.
CATHY WURZER: The movie is called Dreamin' Wild. Its director, Bill Pohlad, is on the line. Good to have you here.
BILL POHLAD: Nice to be here, Cathy.
CATHY WURZER: This story was brought to you, I understand, by another Minnesota producer, Jim Burke, who won the Oscar for Green Book not too long ago. When Jim told you about Donnie and Joe Emerson and the story, what about it piqued your interest?
BILL POHLAD: Well, to be honest, nothing. I mean, not nothing, but at the time, I said, no. Because he pitched me the story-- it sounded a little bit like Searching for Sugar Man, the documentary, which I had seen and liked. So I don't want to do something that's been done before.
So I kind of said no, and he said, well, just listen to the music and read the article that was in The New York Times. And so I did. But ultimately, it was-- I mean, it's a cool story, for sure. But for me, it was meeting Donnie, the real Donnie, and Joe, that really, you know, made me do it. They're such extraordinary people, and the family is really amazing, so.
CATHY WURZER: How involved was the Emerson family in the creation of the film?
BILL POHLAD: Pretty involved. I mean, well, in a good way, they were involved. I mean, sometimes when you're doing stories about real people, you know, it can get complicated if the real people are involved, because they're trying to say, oh, that's not the way it was, or I said this or that, you know. They start getting into the making of the movie, and that's not really healthy.
But you know, they were very involved. We got to shoot on the actual farm in Fruitland, Washington, which is something that never happens. You don't really have that opportunity, generally. So we actually were able to shoot on the real location where everything happened. And again, they were great, the family.
CATHY WURZER: So they did play a role in the creation. And because this is a real-life story, and as you know, real-life stories can be messy, you know, trying to bring that to the big screen can be kind of tricky. What are the issues that you had to navigate in depicting real-life characters?
BILL POHLAD: Well, no, like you say, there's a tendency to, kind of, glorify or dramatize a story, any story. But I mean, what I liked-- what I was most drawn to about these people is that they're so authentic and real, so to speak.
So the challenge was always to represent it well, but be able to kind of give a feel for that closeness for the emotion that happens between them and what-- you know, for the kind of extraordinary people they are. I mean, Don Sr., the father, you know, basically, mortgaged his farm to give Donnie a chance to be successful. But he kind of did it graciously and willingly. And you know, as the film resolves itself, he's generally not-- doesn't have any regrets about that.
CATHY WURZER: It sounds as though the record made by the Emersons carries with it some serious baggage that has affected the family even, what, three decades after the record came out. You mentioned that the father mortgaged the farm. So how has the record reverberated throughout the family narrative?
BILL POHLAD: Well, I mean, you know, first time I met them, they were all about Donnie and all about the record, even though it had happened 30 years ago. They're all still huge Donnie fans and supportive of him and Joe. So yeah, it's-- obviously, the story itself affects the family and is a big factor in the family, even now.
But you know, the movie-- then you layer the movie-making, the movie on top of all of that. And you know, it was a situation where Donnie had a lot of guilt, based on the money that had been spent. And he, you know, didn't really get rid of that guilt over the years.
But you know, the movie is really about dealing with that guilt and those issues of loyalty and responsibility and, really, faith. Because the family's very religious. I mean, we don't hit that on the head or on the nose, but they're an extraordinarily good family, really wonderful family, so.
CATHY WURZER: As I said, real-life stories can be pretty messy but intriguing, you know. Very intriguing. Say, given your screen credits, with the Brian Wilson film, which was terrific-- you did The Runaways, and Radio Utopia-- is there something about musicians that intrigues you?
BILL POHLAD: Well, yeah, I suppose I'm a frustrated musician.
[CATHY LAUGHS]
And-- but I get to channel that through my work sometimes, which is great. You know, obviously, Brian Wilson was a great opportunity to explore that music and to explore, you know, the sounds and all that, that Brian was hearing at that time.
And I wasn't really intending to do another music movie, but when I had met Donnie, it convinced me that, you know, there was something more to this story than the music. It was the human emotions and connections of people, so.
CATHY WURZER: How did it feel to get back in the director's chair?
BILL POHLAD: Fantastic. I mean, you know, I never really wanted to stop, so to speak. But you do-- like, after doing, like, Love and Mercy, you want to make sure that you pick something that you're really passionate about. Because it takes, you know, three years, four years of your life.
And so you really have to be committed to it. At least, that's how I feel. And you know, so you put all your passion into it, so you got to make sure it's the right thing.
CATHY WURZER: And I would-- I've never directed a film, but I would assume that you've got to take and put a lot of your personal energy into getting the best performance from your actors, and you had a heck of a cast to work with.
BILL POHLAD: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, so that is the big-- the job of the director to, kind of, marshal all the forces, so to speak. We had, you know, Casey Affleck, great actor. And not that you just let 'em go-- you still have to provide direction and insight into the characters that will help him.
But you know, he-- obviously, he is very experienced and can do a lot with a little. The rest of the actors-- Zooey Deschanel, Walton Goggins, and Beau Bridges in particular-- all amazing people. They all really connected with the family itself, and with me, and with the message of the story. So it was a joy, honestly, to direct them.
CATHY WURZER: So the family has seen the film, I'm presuming, which must be a little tough-- to let the principles of the story see your work in the end. What did they say about the film?
BILL POHLAD: Yeah, so we premiered the film in Venice, at the Venice Film Festival, in September, last September. And so we-- I took the film to Spokane just before leaving for Venice and showed 'em the film. And it was, obviously, a stressful time. You don't know how they're going to react.
But at the end of the movie, honestly, they, whatever, gave a standing ovation. And Donnie came over and hugged me for an extended period. Really moving. So the whole thing was fantastic-- the relationship with the family and all.
CATHY WURZER: Good, good. Say, before you go, I must ask you this. One of the big debates, of course, in the movie industry is AI, right? You can make younger versions of key characters, could drive more decisions for Hollywood about what projects to greenlight. What do you think artificial intelligence will mean for artistic expression moving forward? Have you thought about it?
BILL POHLAD: Well, yeah, you think about it. I mean, I'm not a big fan. Certainly, artificial intelligence can help us in a lot of different ways and, kind of, even assist in the movie-making process. But I don't think directly being involved in either writing or so-called film-making should be used, I don't think. I don't really favor that, so.
CATHY WURZER: Bill Pohlad, I appreciate your time. It was really fun talking to you. Thank you so very much.
BILL POHLAD: Thank you. It's great to be here.
CATHY WURZER: Bill Pohlad is the director of the new film, Dreamin' Wild, out tomorrow. He'll introduce the 7:15 PM screening tomorrow at the main cinema in Minneapolis.
[DONNIE AND JOHN EMERSON, "BABY"]
SONG: When you're out in the moonlight, lookin' up on the stars above, feels so good when I'm near you, holding hands and making love. Ooh, ooh, baby. Yes, oh, baby.
CATHY WURZER: It's nice to hear the Emersons, Donnie and Joe Emerson.
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